Features, settings & updates

[fladude]

Miss point that Roku bricked use of not just roku sticks and boxes but also TV's

Agree or not able use ...or click agree and go through hoops in snail mailing lots of personal details to not agree.

Yet we BUY the TV's the Boxes the Sticks, their our property...
Roku doesn't OWN them after sold.  But this Bricking unless agree to then un=brick to use your OWN Property is extreme legally questionable.

I could see not able use the Roku channel App nor any apps you pay a sub through Roku say hbo-max subbed through Roku but to brick any use of Your property crossed a line.

If Roku even makes any contention that they retain any rights to the box/stick/TV then such should be totally rokus to Replace repair Free,  if its Roku property and "buying" only gives a "use right"

But no , Roku doesn't contend that they do.

So they have had no right to brick and deny use of property unless click agree
Or click agree then all the hoops to do to refuse their terms..

Either way Rokus impinged on peoples PROPERTY and use of such.

[TheMightyCasey]

You might own the property, but they own the software and control how it's used. This fight has been going on for decades between manufacturers and consumers.

Guess what? It always ends up the very same way. The manufacturers win. So, either suck it up or sell what you have to some who doesn't have a problem with the ToS.

It's your choice, so exercise it, and I do the same. I accepted the ToS because there is no reason not to. The odds of my Roku device causing something so harmful that I would need to seek arbitration is so small that it's almost insufficient, in my eyes. 

You might own the property, but they own the software and control how it's used. This fight has been going on for decades between manufacturers and consumers.

Guess what? It always ends up the very same way. The manufacturers win. So, either suck it up or sell what you have to some who doesn't have a problem with the ToS.

It's your choice, so exercise it, and I do the same. I accepted the ToS because there is no reason not to. The odds of my Roku device causing something so harmful that I would need to seek arbitration are so small that it's almost insufficient, in my eyes. 

Of all the battles in the world worth fighting, my Roku or any other streaming device is not the hill I choose to die on. 

[o2night]

I want to hear you say "SUCK IT UP" when its YOUR information stolen and you get ruined because of it.  Your cold demeanor is exactly why this country is the way it is now. 

So you let Roku talk you into their new arbitration rule, because you think you're not going to ever have anything bad happen to you.  Good for you.  If you are one of the victims of the data breach Roku didn't bother to tell you was their REASON for the new arbitration rules....  When the reality hits you that you have someone using your credit to buy cars and ask for mortgage loans....Guess what.....SUCK IT UP!  Some of us give a ****, even if you don't.

[atc98092]

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@o2night wrote:

So you let Roku talk you into their new arbitration rule, 

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But the point is, that's not anything new. The Roku terms of use has always contained arbitration. And so does Amazon for the Fire TV devices and Apple with their Apple TV. And I'm pretty sure Google Chromecast is the same way. Arbitration was been the way of life for small electronic devices for years. When you're talking about an electronic device that costs under $100 (and perhaps a TV that approaches $1000) arbitration is much less costly for all parties involved, which includes the consumer. Did you read the full terms of use when you bought your first Roku? I certainly didn't, and now knowing some of its contents I'm not bothered by it.

I am NOT excusing the way Roku pushed this latest notification out. It was poorly conceived and implemented even worse. Frankly I think someone at Roku should lose their job for approving that very bad method of putting out the updated TOS. It probably won't happen, but hopefully no one there will ever be stupid enough to do it that way again.

[fladude]

Lets look at software

Say Windows

You Buy a computer, You get software updates until its deemed too old and support ends. At that point you Still have use, you did Buy with computer a License to use
Microsoft cannot just come in and BRICK millions of PC's unless accept "updated TOS"

Updated TOS would only apply to continued support, etc.   No acceptance no more updates..continue to use under old license and without updates.

TOS, updated also would apply to New solkd licenses.

Lets look at Roku, 

They Bricked use, blocked use, unless accept retroactive TOS

You argue its a software thing yet they did sell property, the software side be a license to use the software included, the license must be good as long as  hardware works
there cannot be retroactive changing  TOS or No Use of device unless agree
as then it breaks contract law, violates the meeting of minds at time of purchase... brick use, pay owners back FULL REFUND of what paid then. Millions of Roku TV owners and boxes, sticks should have right to return the devices for full refunds, the company having violated the contract's of sale.

Lets also look at TOS want to push on

It changes peoples basic rights IN LAW and forces arbitration.

You look at what harm device might do and do not realize that the new TOS will block your taking legal action  if Roku has a BREACH of info they get causing ID Theft and thousands of $$$ to Fix an ID Theft arising from the breach of data Roku holds

Roku   does sell through Subscription's where you pay roku not say hulu, netflix,hbo max etc direct but roku.  So Roku has credit card info.  Roku has your Address, Roku has other data.


New TOS forces arbitration  if a data breach exposes info.

Cuts away persons rights to class action, rights to direct sue..

Companys that do not encrypt data, that do not have high security
rather go to arbitration with a hired company that arbitrates (fix is in ) so their exposure for poor security doesnt cost them.

TOS isnt simply about devices working, and software its about limiting their liability if your data they have is  breached.


As far as software, Roku can simply refuse to provide updates to it if dont accept TOS but the software then needs concern only ROKU, with the BRICKING of like a TV 
they deny any use of a TV, the basics...and brick use of other companys APPS to access service paying for.

No Device should be bricked this way unless click an agree in fact their way could if  goes to court be considered a blackmail to regain access of ones property...not much different from ransomware.

Rokus actions may result in Legislation to curtail such action by companys, they should not be able to change TOS retroactively,  in many ways if one sues over a product  your limited to only using laws etc in effect at time of harm occurring.

[fladude]

All updates to TOS usually simply  have ones continued use as agreement,
They also may require agreement to continued use and getting updates.

If one refuses to then usually no more updates but one still has a right of use of the software , updates may cease so eventually software be out of date and not work

However roku is first to actually "ransomeware" agreement

Bricking complete use of ones devices especially TV's unless "agree" is ransom

Further if the Device cannot be updated to use some other software... If not agreeing bricks it  and onbe cannot use the hardware then Roku owes refund in full for the hardware "sold"

For example  one can refuse to agree to microsofts terms... the hardware can be still used, your property, simply a different O/S, software out in to use the hardware

If a roku device cannot be software replaced with some other software,  if roku retains rights to hardware we have a situation then of roku falsely selling a "device" as if one owns it when its really a rental... Even TV's

Roku should by bricking and having devices that cannot use alternative software
fully refund  and take back the devices if refuse the "ransomeware" agree.

There never should been a bricking unless agree, simply if not agree
with a agree/not agree option, then not agreeing simply should stop device updating its roku side software..your limited to what have then, the roku channel be disabled, any Sub's going through Roku be canceled (you would then need to subscribe DIRECT to like hbo max or hulu etc)   Basically disagree any services roku directly provides
be disabled.

One would continue to use the device for things one gets directly like say netfix from netflix.  Roku Channel?  Disabled.

[atc98092]

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@fladude wrote:

...
They Bricked use, blocked use, unless accept retroactive TOS
...

No Device should be bricked this way unless click an agree in fact their way could if  goes to court be considered a blackmail to regain access of ones property...not much different from ransomware.
...

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I don't believe any of us disagree that Roku made a terrible blunder in the way they did this. It was completely unacceptable to block access, especially a TV that has uses other than the Roku OS (OTA broadcasts, HDMI inputs). We can hope that heads will roll over this and they never do something so stupid again. 

As far as the TOS update, the arbitration piece was not new. It was already included in the Roku TOS. Everyone is hollering about it adding binding arbitration, but it was already there. But again, the way Roku pushed this out was completely unacceptable and I hope they have learned a lesson from this. I'm not concerned in the least about the changes to the TOS. But it did anger me the way it was forced on my device with no option to continue use without accepting. 

[Rchoate]

My sharp Roku tv did this last Thursday now it won’t do anything but flash sharp/Roku tv wtf!!!

is there anyway to bypass this tried all the reset methods on Roku community nothing worked?

[Orudy1]

Agree with your premise. I just hope it's not deeper than that for us product owners out here.  I researched patent infringement cases and there's a retry of Roku Inc. v. ITC case # 22-1386 that is in the courts about "Quick Set" s/w patent infringement that may have Roku's lawyers busy.  I did send the opt out letter to them, but haven't heard back (and my 4k TCL tv is still functioning - just viewing live tv from our cable) and hope they don't try and brick it again.  Still not happy with their throwing their platform users under the bus here.  I may be wrong, but am still hoping they'll work something out and don't leave us in a bind.  I don't think this is over yet.  Also what's with the "jump thru hoops" with the squares for verification?  Just another road block for members on the community boards.  A little late much?

[o2night]

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@TheMightyCasey wrote:

 But I still do not see a big deal with the terms of service. Just like all software manufacturers and more and more companies. If you do not agree to the terms. You can't use the product.

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Why is it so hard for people to get the point of this?  The arbitration update wasn't the problem.  It was BRICKING people's tvs to FORCE it.  Some of you people will just throw your high fives in the air to anything.  No wonder the US is in the state it's in.  That is an incorrect statement about software.  Software builders do not have the right to reduce my television to dead wall art if I choose not to let them keep me from using my RIGHT to sue them if they do something bad to me.  Sorry you can't see the reality in front of you.