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Shawnski
Newbie

NFL in spanish on HD Homerun channel with ATSC 3.0 on Flex

Well, we're in week 3 of nfl broadcasts in Spanish with the HD Homerun channel.

I've got a HD Homerun Flex 4k box which picks up the Hartford ATSC 3.0 broadcasts, and I watch it on your best model, the Roku Ultra.  For most everything, the audio for the broadcasts is fine, but every Sunday, the audio for NFL broadcasts is in Spanish.  It doesn't matter whether it's the Fox broadcast or CBS.

You can go ahead and blame the local broadcasters, but I don't have this problem with my much cheaper Tivo Stream 4K or my fire stick.

We've been a Roku house for a while--5 devices!--but if this doesn't get fixed we're gonna have to move on from the Roku universe.  This is an unacceptable software problem.

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11 REPLIES 11
atc98092
Community Streaming Expert

Re: NFL in spanish on HD Homerun channel with ATSC 3.0 on Flex

Silicon Dust has publically stated they aren't putting much effort into their HDHomeRun channel for Roku devices. One of the issues I've heard before is them having a problem identifying the correct audio stream as default, which is what your issue sounds like. 

I just fired mine up, and on my local Fox station I found the same issue: the audio was Spanish, and the channel offered no other audio track choice. I then fired up the app on my Shield, and the same channel was 5.1 English. 

But, you can't blame Roku for the issue. This is something Silicon Dust has to fix, and they don't seem to be too concerned about fixing it. They are the ones you need to complain to. Here's a link to their ATSC 3.0 forum. Users have complained about their Roku app for more than a year. 

Dan

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rmschooley
Reel Rookie

Re: NFL in spanish on HD Homerun channel with ATSC 3.0 on Flex

I disagree with this assessment. It is my understanding that the hdhomerun app simply passes through the selected broadcast to the built-in roku media player. As such, it is the code for the built-in roku media player (and not the code for the hdhomerun app) that is responsible for displaying the video and playing the audio.

Based on my testing (by looking at the stream using vlc and interpreting it using mediainfo), it looks like the roku media player is *always* playing the first audio program of the broadcast. For many channels, this is the english language audio program. But for other channels, it is the spanish language audio program. Unlike with ATSC 1.0, ATSC 3.0 does not have a "primary" and "secondary" audio programs -- it instead has one or more non-sorted audio programs.

Instead of just always playing the first audio program, the roku media player should either provide an option to play the english audio program, or provide an option to play *any* audio program, or just play the audio program for the user's language setting.

In summary, I believe Roku can indeed be blamed for this issue.

 

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atc98092
Community Streaming Expert

Re: NFL in spanish on HD Homerun channel with ATSC 3.0 on Flex

@rmschooley you certainly could be correct. Roku stopped making any updates to RMP for video playback almost two years ago, and there certainly could be issues with it's recognition of the correct audio track to play. I do know that RMP has a number of issues with video playback that have not been addressed for a very long time. I don't know if it's possible for the HDHR channel to specify the audio track to play, but that might be a way to resolve the issue. But based on comments on the SD forum, they aren't making much of an effort on the Roku channel. The app on my Shield works better, mostly because of a vastly better user interface. The Roku appears fine for playback, equal to the Shield, other that this issue with some audio tracks not being in the expected language.

Dan

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rmschooley
Reel Rookie

Re: NFL in spanish on HD Homerun channel with ATSC 3.0 on Flex

SiliconDust tells me their channel is only responsible for selecting which broadcast stream to pass through to the Roku Media Player. In other words, SiliconDust states they are passing through the broadcast stream completely unmodified and that it is up to the media player to decide what to do with the video and audio programs within that stream. Although I am certainly not an expert in such matters, this seems to make sense to me. If they do indeed pass the broadcast stream through unmodified, it seems unlikely there is any mechanism for them to indicate which audio program to play.

Roku's decision to always play the first audio program (assuming that is indeed what they are doing) should always work perfectly fine if the user wants to listen to the english audio program on an ATSC 1.0 Broadcast. That is, I believe an ATSC 1.0 Broadcast (at least on an english channel) will always have the english audio on the first audio program and the spanish audio on the second audio program.

However, this convention (requirement?) does not hold true for ATSC 3.0 Broadcasts. For whatever reason, spanish audio is the first program on many of the ATSC 3.0 Broadcasts here in Houston. The best and most correct solution would obviously be for the roku media player to identify and play the audio program that matches the current user's default language setting.

Of course, it should also be mentioned that we wouldn't have this issue if the broadcasters simply put the english program first and the spanish program second for their ATSC 3.0 Broadcasts. Is there some technical reason why they are not doing this? At least to me, it seems rather odd they are not already doing this. I am trying to find an engineering contact at my local tv stations to ask this question, but have not had any luck in finding anyone so far.

Does Roku monitor and read these forum posts?

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atc98092
Community Streaming Expert

Re: NFL in spanish on HD Homerun channel with ATSC 3.0 on Flex


@rmschooley wrote:

Does Roku monitor and read these forum posts?


Roku has employee moderators here, but they are not tech support, and it's questionable if there's any active effort on RMP right now. I can't even get an answer from the beta side of the house, so no idea what's happening with RMP anymore. 

Dan

Roku Community Streaming Expert

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renojim
Community Streaming Expert

Re: NFL in spanish on HD Homerun channel with ATSC 3.0 on Flex

This is how it's supposed to work:
https://developer.roku.com/docs/references/scenegraph/media-playback-nodes/video.md#automatic-audio-...

SD is being a little disingenuous if they're trying to say they have no control over what audio track plays in their channel/app.

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rmschooley
Reel Rookie

Re: NFL in spanish on HD Homerun channel with ATSC 3.0 on Flex

@renojim If SD's Channel/App is only responsible for *selecting* a particular broadcast stream to send to the built-in Roku Media Player App (as opposed to *playing* a particular broadcast stream), I am a little confused why you believe they are being disingenuous. It seems to me the application responsible for *playing* the stream (which again is not SD's Channel/App but instead Roku's Media Player App) is the application that should also be responsible for selecting the audio track.

Needless to say, I may not be fully understanding exactly how SD's Channel/App interacts with the built-in Roku Media Player App. But -- If the Roku Media Play App is indeed receiving the full broadcast stream (i.e. the stream that contains a video program along with multiple audio programs), it certainly seems to me as though it (i.e. the Roku Media Player App) should be the entity following the rules you linked to in your post since it is the application being presented with multiple audio tracks.

In short -- If Roku's Media Player App is being sent a broadcast with multiple audio tracks where one track is clearly marked as english and the other is clearly marked as spanish, why isn't it playing the english audio track since Rule 1b, 1c, 1d, and 1e would seem to indicate it should do so since no track has been explicitly selected by the user (i.e. Rule 1a) and english has been selected as the user's preferred language?

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renojim
Community Streaming Expert

Re: NFL in spanish on HD Homerun channel with ATSC 3.0 on Flex

I guess I'm confused by what you mean by SD's channel/app.  I assumed you meant this one:
https://channelstore.roku.com/details/f46afc2e43bc466ec6af01914b8851a3/hdhomerun

I can understand why they'd say they're not responsible for how RMP chooses which audio track to play.  I wouldn't be at all surprised if Roku's stated "rules" for choosing the audio track don't work the way they claim or has a bug.  Trying to get Roku to spend any time looking into an issue that only affects a very small number of people is going to be tough if not impossible.

 

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rmschooley
Reel Rookie

Re: NFL in spanish on HD Homerun channel with ATSC 3.0 on Flex

SD's Channel/App is indeed the HDHomeRun Channel/App at https://channelstore.roku.com/details/f46afc2e43bc466ec6af01914b8851a3/hdhomerun

But, SD claims that their HDHomeRun Channel/App calls the Roku Media Player App/Channel which is presumably at https://channelstore.roku.com/details/1829ae20b082957f963d7dab42abf7e5/roku-media-player

Specifically, SD claims the Roku Media Player App/Channel is the application that actually plays the audio and video of the broadcast that is merely *selected* by the HDHomeRun Channel/App. 

I hope this provides a little more clarification!

As a software developer, I would think it would be pretty easy to correct the behavior of the Roku Media Player. As a software developer, I also realize it will be tough if not impossible to get anyone to do this since as you mention it at least currently only impacts a small number of users! 😢

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