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MazeWizzard
Level 7

Interesting.... Another device

Keep on innovating Roku. Kudos.

http://www.usatoday.com/tech/products/s ... 52368412/1

I'd love to see specs/SDK info when you get ready for it (after CES?).

EDIT: Dang. Someone on the main/general forum beat me to it. lol.
0 Kudos
11 REPLIES 11
EnTerr
Level 11

Re: Interesting.... Another device

Wow. Not bad, not bad at all!

I see a problem though, it won't work on virtually any TV you may have, since says it needs a new HDL interface support. HDL, i read, does not use any of USB or HDMI protocols while it may use their connectors. I looked up and there seem to be onlyMcouple of TVs so far produced, by Samsung and Toshiba - which i did not see readily available on american market. And those are not just any TVs, they are smart TVs on high-end, with internet connectivity/web browsing built in already. So, if i get such TV, which i bet has Netflix/Amazon/Hulu+/Pandora/Blockbuster - why would i want Roku dongle, out of nostalgia? I read HDL can be converted to HDMI with smart cable or dock... yeah ok, so imagine dock the size of Roku2, what's the point?

The issue of how this device will be controlled is interesting one, since can't hope for infrared visibility no more. So it is either bluetooth or HDMI/CEC - i loke the second one better, since it means one can use the TV remote for it.
0 Kudos
TheEndless
Level 10

Re: Interesting.... Another device

"EnTerr" wrote:
Wow. Not bad, not bad at all!

I see a problem though, it won't work on virtually any TV you may have, since says it needs a new HDL interface support. HDL, i read, does not use any of USB or HDMI protocols while it may use their connectors. I looked up and there seem to be onlyMcouple of TVs so far produced, by Samsung and Toshiba - which i did not see readily available on american market. And those are not just any TVs, they are smart TVs on high-end, with internet connectivity/web browsing built in already. So, if i get such TV, which i bet has Netflix/Amazon/Hulu+/Pandora/Blockbuster - why would i want Roku dongle, out of nostalgia? I read HDL can be converted to HDMI with smart cable or dock... yeah ok, so imagine dock the size of Roku2, what's the point?

The issue of how this device will be controlled is interesting one, since can't hope for infrared visibility no more. So it is either bluetooth or HDMI/CEC - i loke the second one better, since it means one can use the TV remote for it.

According to the Roku blog (http://blog.roku.com/blog/2012/01/04/ro ... ing_stick/), "They’ll only need to use one remote for their TV and for streaming." I wonder if part of the MHL spec is a standardized control scheme that all MHL enabled televisions will include on their remotes.
My Channels: http://roku.permanence.com - Twitter: @TheEndlessDev
Instant Watch Browser (NetflixIWB), Aquarium Screensaver (AQUARIUM), Clever Clocks Screensaver (CLEVERCLOCKS), iTunes Podcasts (ITPC), My Channels (MYCHANNELS)
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MazeWizzard
Level 7

Re: Interesting.... Another device

That's my understanding too TheEndless. The protocol includes power for the stick via the MHL and also control protocols. So it is the TV that's getting info from it's own remote, then sending the info to the stick.

True that only the newest of TVs will have it. But.... without it, if you needed a separate power supply and separate remote... you'd have a roku2.

I've often wondered over the years about why the new "smart TV" standards were so dumb....building the computer into the TV with no way to upgrade hardware. I realized, of course, that a hardware manufacturer wasn't very motivated to make, for example, a PCIe slotted TV with a plug-n-upgrade option. You know, unplug the 3 or 4 year old hardware, plug in the new. Of course, that would add a few bucks to the manufacturing costs and complicate the interface. They want you to give the TV to the grandkids and buy a new one. I'm surprised that this MHL standard even made it. lol.

I've always thought the computer and TV would merge. Didn't realize they would build it all into the screen. The screen is one "generic piece" that should be swappable. Like computer monitors used to be...just monitors. Now everyone uses TVs Smiley LOL This standard was meant for smart phones and such, I believe. Hey... Roku Phone...

The other way to look at it is... why does a TV manufacturer want to be in the software/computer business? Why not just produce a MHL based TV and let "the other guys [like Roku]" produce the software/box for "smarts". Then the only thing the TV has to have is a small processor for dealing with the remote and protocol. The EXTERNAL device would do the rest and be upgradable. That's the future market they're trying to get in on, I'll bet.

EDIT: HDMI->MHL
0 Kudos
EnTerr
Level 11

Re: Interesting.... Another device

"TheEndless" wrote:
According to the Roku blog (http://blog.roku.com/blog/2012/01/04/ro ... ing_stick/), "They’ll only need to use one remote for their TV and for streaming." I wonder if part of the MHL spec is a standardized control scheme that all MHL enabled televisions will include on their remotes.

See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mobile_Hig ... ition_Link : "The HDTV remote will control the connected device with guaranteed mixed manufacturer interoperability (CEC)."

See also http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HDMI#CEC , CEC is part of HDMI spec and while support not obligatory, it has been implemented already by many.
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EnTerr
Level 11

Re: Interesting.... Another device

"MazeWizzard" wrote:
That's my understanding too TheEndless. The protocol includes power for the stick via the HDMI and also control protocols. So it is the TV that's getting info from it's own remote, then sending the info to the stick.

i checked pinout and HDMI by spec provides max 50mA @5V = 0.25W. Roku2 platform requires 5W, 20x is too much of a gap to jump, so dont think standard HDMI can manage it. MDL will be able to provide more power while using HDMI connector but there are practically no TVs with MDL yet... and i wonder if it will we widely implemented, because MDL is protocol for cable-connecting mobile phones to TVs, you think there will be much interest in that?
0 Kudos
MazeWizzard
Level 7

Re: Interesting.... Another device

"EnTerr" wrote:
"MazeWizzard" wrote:
That's my understanding too TheEndless. The protocol includes power for the stick via the HDMI and also control protocols. So it is the TV that's getting info from it's own remote, then sending the info to the stick.

i checked pinout and HDMI by spec provides max 50mA @5V = 0.25W. Roku2 platform requires 5W, 20x is too much of a gap to jump, so dont think standard HDMI can manage it. MDL will be able to provide more power while using HDMI connector but there are practically no TVs with MDL yet... and i wonder if it will we widely implemented, because MDL is protocol for cable-connecting mobile phones to TVs, you think there will be much interest in that?


Yeah... I should have said MHL... not HDMI... my bad. Edited.

This site: http://www.siliconimage.com/technologie ... &Section=1
talks about MHL power specs (5 volts, 500 mA = 2.5 watts).

IDK about the MDL stuff. That's the "fun" part of technology... guessing what standards will come out on top.
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EnTerr
Level 11

Re: Interesting.... Another device

"MazeWizzard" wrote:
IDK about the MDL stuff. That's the "fun" part of technology... guessing what standards will come out on top.


It will be a FANTASTIC niche for Roku if someone releases cheap TVs with MDL but no apps, networking and any smartness. Then this dongle will absolutely smartify such TVs with the bonus pointed out by Wood, to be replaced every few year and different brand TVs will be getting smarter and smarter w/o manufacturer having to invest in app development.
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MazeWizzard
Level 7

Re: Interesting.... Another device

OK. Guess I'm wrong again. Looks like TV manufacturers DO want to be in the PC business:

http://www.usatoday.com/tech/news/story ... 52420894/1
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EnTerr
Level 11

Re: Interesting.... Another device

"MazeWizzard" wrote:
OK. Guess I'm wrong again. Looks like TV manufacturers DO want to be in the PC business:
http://www.usatoday.com/tech/news/story ... 52420894/1

Vizio is not typical TV maker, they've been known to call "unrepairable" $1500+ TV sets just out of 12mo warranty because of dead LED backlight. So upgrade and long-life is not something on their mind. Sprawling into any electronics that can make money, on the other hand, is: in 2011 they released mobile phone and a tablet (notable feature of the tablet: embedded IR remote blaster)
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