Network - Wireless & Wired Connections

Help & troubleshooting for network issues, including connecting your device to your home Wi-Fi network, connecting to public networks, troubleshooting wireless issues & ethernet connections, and optimizing streaming performance.
cancel
Showing results for 
Show  only  | Search instead for 
Did you mean: 
leres
Level 7

Roku Ultra 2020 not compatible with 802.3az EEE Green Ethernet

I just upgraded from an Ultra 2018 (4660X) to an Ultra 2020 (4800X). I use wired Ethernet and found that the new Ultra will not connect to my HP1820 managed Ethernet switch. The problem stumped the first level tech via chat and I was told the next level support would contact me via email "within 2 days".

I tried a port on a GS108LP POE switch I have in my home network with no change. But I later found I could get a connection to the network if I chained the new Ultra via a spare netgear GS105 switch.

Today I looked a the configuration on the HP1820 and found the Ultra 2020 will connect to the network if I turn off "Lower Power Idle" (which uses almost 4 watts more than when it is enabled).

hpe1820.png

Given the variety of devices I have connected to the HP1820 and the fact that the Ultra 2018 always worked I find it difficult to believe this is a hardware issue with the Ultra 2020; the question is will Roku release firmware to address this issue? (Or will I be returning it to amazon?)

0 Kudos
10 REPLIES 10\
StreamerUser
Level 20

Re: Roku Ultra 2020 not compatible with 802.3az EEE Green Ethernet

This is the type of issue you need to directly contact Roku support for:

chat or email:  https://support.roku.com/contactus/contact-options (choose setup/ultra/other/need more help?)

0 Kudos
leres
Level 7

Re: Roku Ultra 2020 not compatible with 802.3az EEE Green Ethernet

I just got a new ultra (4802X) and am amazed to find this is still an issue! I'm completely unable to setup this box with wired ethernet ("unable to find ethernet", error 013.50).

I had (incorrectly) assumed that since more and more routers and switches now implement 802.3az EEE Green Ethernet that roku would have added support. But I was wrong!

0 Kudos
UserOfStreamers
Level 12

Re: Roku Ultra 2020 not compatible with 802.3az EEE Green Ethernet

@leres 

You should have researched this before purchasing the 4800 - regardless if you can disable it per the port the 4800 is connected to (as per the OP), you should be able to connect without issue.

fluke
Level 13

Re: Roku Ultra 2020 not compatible with 802.3az EEE Green Ethernet


@UserOfStreamers wrote:

@leres 

You should have researched this before purchasing the 4800 - regardless if you can disable it per the port the 4800 is connected to (as per the OP), you should be able to connect without issue.

What would additional research have turned up in terms of Roku technical disclosures?

Roku promotes the product as "Energy Star certified to save you money and help protect the environment."  This is at odds with Roku thumbing their nose at honoring an energy savings standard the IEEE ratified back in 2010 over a decade ago.  At no point does Roku disclose that 802.3az is *NOT* supported to assist someone in making an informed choice.  Researching before the purchase is just going to turn up the misleading advertising.

I also question the assertion that a HPE OfficeConnect 1820 switch has the option to turn of energy efficient ethernet on a per port basis.  From what I can find it is all or nothing for the switch.  Disabling an energy savings standard for all 24 or 48 ports on a switch just so one non-compliant so-called "Energy Star certified" device can connect is not the best way to "save money and help protect the environment."  While it is true that once the IEEE standard is disabled the Roku does connect, claiming it can "connect without issue" is just not true because the product at that point fails to work as advertised as a green device.

This is not the only anti-green "feature" of the Roku Ultra 2022.  Previously the consumer could replace the batteries in the Roku remote.  Rechargeable batteries have a limited number of times they can be recharged.  For example, Eneloop batteries will degrade after over 2100 recharging cycles.  But once they do degrade you used to be able to just replace them with new Eneloop batteries.  However, with the Roku Ultra 2022 remote, once the built-in battery degrades it becomes time to replace the *ENTIRE* remote.  That is simply NOT a "green" solution.

 

AvsGunnar
Community Streaming Expert

Re: Roku Ultra 2020 not compatible with 802.3az EEE Green Ethernet

@fluke 

"I also question the assertion that a HPE OfficeConnect 1820 switch has the option to turn of energy efficient ethernet on a per port basis... "

page 77 (8-2) https://support.hpe.com/hpesc/public/docDisplay?docId=c04622710

Otherwise, devices would be be subject to damage if unable to disable POE.

Roku Community Streaming Expert
Just another Roku user... I am not a Roku employee.
Insignia RokuTV, Ultra 4660x, Premiere+ 3921, Express 4k+ 3941
UserOfStreamers
Level 12

Re: Roku Ultra 2020 not compatible with 802.3az EEE Green Ethernet

@fluke 

If one is looking for a specific standard/specification supported/implemented in a product, and the product technical specifications doesnt mention it, a reasonable logical conclusion would be that it isnt supported. 

Of course, if one isnt sure the technical specs/docs are accurate, one can always buy the product and test it - but then one generally doesnt complain on the technical support boards that a product doesnt support a standard that wasnt actually listed in the specs (well, not unless basic logic and reasoning along with basic consumer "common sense" are somehow absent in the process, which seems to be increasingly common).

(FYI, thats generally how technical specs work - supported standards/functionality/etc are listed, non-supported/not-implemented ones are not).

Specifically, "Energy Efficient Internet" <> "Energy Star Certified", and just because a product is "Energy Star Certified" does not mean it is required to support 802.3az (again, basic research and logic apply here).

Most specifically, "Energy Star certified" is mentioned in the product details/specs, whereas "Energy Efficient Ethernet" is not, so a simple reasoning process leads to "this product does not support Energy Efficient Ethernet".

Researching the product (at the very easy to find product page:  https://www.roku.com/products/roku-ultra) doesnt turn up misleading advertising (see above as per actual listed specs), however, it does apparently seem to turn up uneducated/obstinate/agendized consumers making strange irrational arguments based on obviously false claims.

There is plenty to criticize Roku about in terms of specification/standard support and poor documentation and/or product design, but in this specific case (lack of EEE support isnt listed of course) the easily obtainable information/facts/logic simply dont support it.

Perhaps a better (and more obviously rational/logical/practical) process/position would be to suggest/give feedback to Roku (there is a forum location/process for that) to support EEE (and/or remotes with easily removable rechargeable batteries), not to criticize them for not listing a standard they dont support (a strange and bizarre argument at best).

fluke
Level 13

Re: Roku Ultra 2020 not compatible with 802.3az EEE Green Ethernet

@UserOfStreamers 

The key item is this is a regression.  The Roku Ultra 2018 did support 802.3az.

Based on your logic, we should not assume any Roku Ultra has ever correctly supported the IEEE 802.1 specifications for ethernet since they never explicitly state  802.1.  Only IEEE standard they directly reference is 802.11ac.

So both Roku Ultra 2018 and Roku Ultra 2022 state they support "10/100 Base-T Ethernet" without indicating any change in that support.  In addition Roku Ultra 2022 adds Energy Star(TM).  And yet *removes* support for a decade old energy saving standard that the Ultra 2018 supported.

Even researching as far down as the Linux kernel that Roku published for both models does not reveal a reason why someone should expect this regression.

Energy Star certification should indicate the manufacturer not only made an effort to reduce the electricity used directly by the device but also the devices it interacts with.  That is the reason recent Roku Ultra models will eventually stop providing a video signal when left idle for a long time.  This not only reducing the power draw of the Roku but also can be detected by Energy Star compliant TVs to eventually automatically turn off.  How Roku impacts the energy draw of the network equipment it is connected to *should* have also been a consideration.

The EPA which runs the Energy Star certification program accepts complaints and will re-evaluate the certification rating based on those complaints.  The *REGRESSION* from previously supporting 802.3az on the previous Roku Ultra 2018 and then removing that support for the Roku Ultra 2022 should have been disclosed to the EPA during the certification process.  It is requested the customer initially contact the manufacturer to find out if there is a mistake and the manufacturer is operating in good faith.  If the problem can be corrected by the manufacturer then there is no reason to re-evaluate the E.S. certification.

What the EPA *NEVER* does is ask the customer to research by buying the product to test it and if such testing reveals an energy saving standard has been removed in the newer model to just silently return it (and to just shut up about the regression).  That simply isn't how the Energy Star program works.

By posting to the manufacturer's own forum, the OP has shown they made the effort to provide notification of the problem.  The ball is now on Roku's side to demonstrate they are operating in good faith regarding their use of the Energy Star trademark.

fluke
Level 13

Re: Roku Ultra 2020 not compatible with 802.3az EEE Green Ethernet


@AvsGunnar wrote:

@fluke 

"I also question the assertion that a HPE OfficeConnect 1820 switch has the option to turn of energy efficient ethernet on a per port basis... "

page 77 (8-2) https://support.hpe.com/hpesc/public/docDisplay?docId=c04622710

Otherwise, devices would be be subject to damage if unable to disable POE.


POE can be configured on a per port basis for the ports that support it.  That is not the same as being able to configured EEE on a per port basis.  You can have a 802.3az compliant switch that has *NO* support for POE.

AvsGunnar
Community Streaming Expert

Re: Roku Ultra 2020 not compatible with 802.3az EEE Green Ethernet

You are correct on that regarding the EEE settings being switchwide. (caveat below).  I read the posting too quickly and caught the individual port configuration as your concern on that switch.  However, normally if you can see that individual ports are able to be configured as such, often can be used to see what other settings can be used to avoid a blanket setting. 

The switch when enabled in Low Power Mode (EEE), is supposed to automatically detect connected  devices and shut off power to the port when no network activity is present.   EEE works for ports in auto-negotiation mode on this switch. (p.90)

As such, can certainly try a manual setting of 100Fdx(100 Mbps, full-duplex).  May have to experiment a bit, but may be able to avoid this conflict by simply disabling auto negotiation on the individual port. (p.30 - changing interface physical mode - disable auto negotiation).  This should allow rest of switch to remain in EEE mode and affect devices it is compatible with on ports with auto negotiation enabled.

Why the previous Ultra model worked with the switch, no idea on that one, other than sometimes newer not always better.  Have a suspicion it is probably firmware related.

-----

Roku devices have occassionally had issues with various switches here in the Community.  Not much with unmanaged switches (some), but the more complicated managed switches with more settings, the more issues.  These devices do not like losing network connection.  Once it does, it can be a bear sometimes just to regain a simple network connection.  The more on/off switches placed in that network discovery, the more difficult it is going to be at times. (sometimes, even impossible - it just is incompatible).

As for green ethernet and other networking practices, if that is one's thing, more power to you. (sincerely, not a jab).  It is sometimes difficult enough to get everything to work in harmony across a network than having to have every device automatically comply and be compatible with every other energy saving device and expect it to do so at any given time.

It would probably be more beneficial for large office buildings and corporations to turn off their lights and unneeded computers at night before heading home than for the individual with a Roku to be overly-concerned with his device's total calculated power draw while streaming Seinfeld reruns.

Can accomplish this by merely bypassing the EEE switch for this single device rather than disabling EEE capability for entire network.  Not always a one or the other situation.  

-----

The manual dl for page numbers referenced above (https://www.hpe.com/psnow/doc/c04622710?section=Product%20Documentation) 

Roku Community Streaming Expert
Just another Roku user... I am not a Roku employee.
Insignia RokuTV, Ultra 4660x, Premiere+ 3921, Express 4k+ 3941